Wherein I make everyone hate me.

As an educator, one of the discussions we would often have is consequences for actions.  I had an administrator (let’s call him John) who didn’t believe in raising his voice or being harsh with kids.  I remember seeing John talking to a kid who was in trouble.  He was verbally coaxing this child (6 years old) from the lunchroom to the office which was about 70 feet apart and I am not even exaggerating when I say I went to the lounge to eat my lunch and when I came back to pick up my kids, he had calmly talked this child into moving only about 20 feet.  20 FEET in 20 MINUTES.  I couldn’t believe it.

John thought that my discipline of my students was far too harsh.  I went in to speak with him one day because when a sub had been in my room one child had grabbed another in a head lock, was stabbing him with a pencil, and whispering in his ear that he was going to murder him.  No consequences were given to the boy.

I shouldn’t have gone in there when I found out, because I was REALLY heated.  If I can’t promise my kids safety in school, well then I didn’t deserve to have a classroom (in my opinion).  This is the least I would expect from Finn’s future teacher’s and if they can’t provide that peace of mind, he will not be in their class.  I will never forget what he said to me that day.  “If a child leaves with a limb dragging behind them, what do they learn?”

This was the direction we were moving toward as a school.  I don’t believe that kids should be punished for punishing sake.  However, I do believe that when certain actions result in the world coming down around that person, they will think twice before doing it again.  I know that it has to be a consequence that teaches.  The administration thought I went too far with consequences and I heard about it constantly.

I remember when a new student joined my class with only about 12 weeks left of school.  He had a very hard home life, spent most of his time at home caring for himself.  He was very physical with other kids, for no apparent reason.  As soon as he did that I came down on him, and I came down hard.  I always had a “conference” with the kid when something like this happened so I could talk to them about why I was very unhappy with their choices, discuss what other choices they could have made, that I don’t like their ACTIONS but I do like THEM, and if anyone were to do that to them, I would come down just as hard on the other kid.  This little boy wasn’t new to getting in trouble, I’m sure he’d heard a million speeches that were nearly identical to mine and I could see the instant I lost him as his eyes wandered.

It was only a few days later that I caught another boy pushing him in the hallway.  I was on that kid so fast, their head was spinning.  I also saw the second the first boy understood that I was there to protect him too.  After that moment I never had a problem with this child.  He was attached to me like a second skin.  He would walk down the hall holding my hand and give me bear hugs constantly though out the day.

He still had behavior issues in other classes and even with the administration.  He kicked, punched, and slapped the principal.  This boy was looking for was someone who he could trust and would continue to love him even after he made a bad choice.  Even though he wasn’t in my class for very long, this particular boy will always be in my heart.  I wish it was this “simple” to reach out to kids and I only had success when dealing with kids.  That’s not life.  I do believe that every kid just wants to know they are loved, no matter what they do and they are trying to figure out who they can trust.

So after much reflection in what I know to be true, what I believe in, and my intention in dealing with people, I think it’s appropriate to have very strict consequences for kids and that’s what we employ with Finn (and will continue to in the future).

For example, when Finn comes to the age where he will have time on the computer, we will closely monitor what he is doing, where he is spending his time, and who he talks to.  If he abuses his privilege, then we will shut his world down.  He will have everything taken away from him so he feels like he’s on lock down because the internet can be a very scary place and I couldn’t live with myself knowing that I allowed that to happen to my son when I could have prevented it.  It also scares me because I think kids are too trusting and give out information, unknowingly that could put their well being into jeopardy.  Predators on the internet are very smart and clever and can find victims from a scrap of information here paired with another, that no one else would thing to put together.

A study showed that there was a large town with huge crime problem and the police wouldn’t respond to calls in this particular neighborhood because it was so dangerous.  There was a subway station and nearly everyone hopped the turn-styles since there were no consequences for their actions.  There was graffiti all over the trains.

When they looked for a way to address this crime problem they decided to try something different than they had done in the past.  They cracked down on these small crimes.  Police were stationed to make sure everyone paid to ride the train and if there was graffiti, the train would get repainted before it went out in public again.

**Side note**I personally think ALL trains are more beautiful with graffiti on them.  It is beautiful art, but that’s just me.

This sent a very clear message to the citizens.  Even the smallest crime was going to be prosecuted.  What they found was this dramatically decreased crime in all areas.  The message was they were valuable enough to ride in trains cars that were without graffiti.  And they also found that almost overnight, the only one’s that jumped the turn-styles were NOT law abiding citizens, so they were able to catch people that were involved with serious crimes from those that were perpetrating small, insignificant crimes.

If people are held responsible for small, “victimless” crimes, it not only stops the small crimes but often also the larger, violent crimes.

I had been hearing about some old news stories that made me really consider this further.  There were 2 stories in particular (that had occurred a decade or more ago) where the victims gave interviews recently now that they were adults.

In the first one, there were twin girls who were being routinely raped by their two older brothers.  When they told their father, instead of protecting them, he began to rape them as well.  They lived in this hell for years.  When they were finally rescued, their brothers served only 15 years and their father was already out, serving less than 10 years.

A second story I heard was about a family who took the abuse of their children to extremes.  There were multiple kids in the family and all were abused, but their little girl got the majority of the attention.  She lived in her personal hell for 7 years before she was rescued.  Her parents had kept her in a dog kennel which looked smaller than the one we use for our lab.  The kennel was kept in their unfinished basement, with no light (artificial or otherwise), they only provided the smallest amount of food for her to live on, she ate it from a dog bowl, and they wouldn’t let her out to use the bathroom.  Which of course resulted in accidents and the parents would become so upset by this that they would spray her with ice cold water while she was in the cage.

She endured 7 years of this torture.  SEVEN. YEARS.  I can’t imagine living like that for one day much less 3,657 days.  How much prison time did her parents get?  One year.  You didn’t read that wrong…ONE. YEAR.  They didn’t even have to serve as long as she did (and prison with 3 meals a day and toilet would have seemed like heaven to her).

For me, there is not harsh enough punishment for these types of crimes and it really tests my belief in opposing capital punishment.  In my classroom and for my son, they might not learn from losing a limb, but they will learn from the world crashing down around their head so they know they know their actions are unacceptable and I expect them to make better choices in the future.  My hope in this is, if we sweat the small stuff today, there won’t be big stuff in the future.

I was watching the movie Freakonomics which had some very interesting points…some of which I agree with and some that I don’t.  One that I found astonishing was about legalizing abortion was directly tied to a reduction in crime.  Now I don’t think people should get pregnant if and until they’re ready.  I do believe in birth control.  I wish there was no necessity for abortions…but we’re not there yet and I don’t want anybody else to have jurisdiction over my uterus or anyone else’s.

Their study showed that women who had unplanned pregnancy and took advantage of abortion delayed childbearing which allowed them to get to a point in their life where they could provide a great life for their children.  This ability to delay having children was directly linked to a reduction in crime.  When we force women to carry and raise their children when they’re not ready, they will most likely NOT finish school, which greatly reduces getting a job where they get paid a living wage and can provide for their family, so they live in poverty needing to work multiple jobs just to keep a roof over their head and food on the table which creates a cycle where their children will most likely follow in their parents footsteps.

I would rather have a child be aborted than forcing babies to become parents who raise children that will often end up behind bars.  I am NOT saying that pregnant women should be pressured or even nudged toward getting an abortion unless and until they have the ability to provide for their child.  I AM saying that they should have the OPTION of delaying parenthood for themselves to create a better life for themselves and their family.  When abortion is taken out of the picture, women are more likely to keep and raise their children verses giving them up for adoption.  And even if they did put their child up for adoption, simply carrying a child often will create a situation where the mom falls behind in school, often to drop out.

I also AM NOT arguing that abortion should be used to control crime.  I AM saying that sometimes positive outcomes from difficult situations.  If I started training to run a marathon to get in shape, my intention might not be weight-loss, yet that would be an unintended consequence whether or not that was the intentional goal.  If abortion is an option, lower crime rates could be an unintended consequence.

Where do you come down?  Do you prefer a gentle use of consequence or do you drop the hammer?  Do you believe stricter consequences, earlier, will result in better choices in the future?  Good outcomes from horribly difficult situations.

**EDIT-as I just re-read this, I have another perspective, but it’s long already, so check back tomorrow.**

Related Posts Plugin for WordPress, Blogger...
This entry was posted in Parenting, Personal, Politics, Teacher Tales and tagged , . Bookmark the permalink.

19 Responses to Wherein I make everyone hate me.

  1. Raven says:

    I honestly don’t know what to say about the discipline thing. I’ve been a pretty permissive parent and my girls (so far) haven’t gotten into much trouble at all. The youngest has some behavioral and emotional problems, but I think that’s more genetics than anything else. My eldest doesn’t have those problems and if it was my permissiveness that caused the youngest’s problems, the eldest would have the same problems. But, having said that, in looking back I do wish there were some things I was stricter on, such as household chores, tv watching, etc.

    As to the abortion thing. I totally agree with you. We should have the option if we need it. No one has the right to tell me what I do with my body or force me to bear and then raise a child I can’t afford or care for or whatever. Not to mention that making abortion illegal will not stop the abortions. Rich women will be able to obtain safe, albeit illegal abortions while poor women will die in back alley clinics and two lives will be lost. I am very strongly Pro-Choice. And what makes me crazy is that most of the time the same people that are anti-choice are also anti-public assistance of any kind. So, they want to force a woman to have a baby she can’t afford then refuse to help her support it. If the concern here was really for the ‘child’ wouldn’t they want to ensure that that child had enough food, clothing, a roof over their head etc.? The fact is, they don’t care about the child, they just want to control women’s bodies.

    Great post!!
    Raven recently posted..Its the End of The World as We Know It-Random Tuesday ThoughtsMy Profile

  2. Denise says:

    Excellent post, Kate, and I’m looking forward for the one today – you said you kind of changed your mind about something… I totally agree with the following in particular:
    “I do believe that every kid just wants to know they are loved, no matter what they do and they are trying to figure out who they can trust.”
    Yes, I do believe so… and about internet control for kids and other topics as well… I must confess I got very scared about the time such criminals get behind bars – one year for those parents??? Poor girl. Poor girl! And those brothers and father as well, I almost couldn’t believe what I was reading. Incredible… but so is our society… very nice written, Kate, all you say remind me of a quote (I confess I don’t know whose quote it is and I won’t google it now…):
    “What worries me is not the voice (noise) of the bad people, but the silence of the good”.
    Well done, Kate!
    Denise recently posted..Shoeper Shoe Challenge 9My Profile

  3. maggie says:

    I think the world as a whole has become to afraid to punish. It’s a slippery slope in either direction, I think. . . there are certainly times in human history where consequences easily outweighed the crime. . . and now we’re in a peiod where often the consequences are not nearly severe enough. I’m not suggesting human rights shouldn’t be respected… but the whole “innocent until proven guilty” goes a bit far… there’s so much focus put on being absolutely 100% certain that the crime was committed, and so little focus on matching punishment to crime. . . I get right rotted when cases happen where the guilty party gets off easy, or entirely, because due process wasn’t followed and damning evidence can’t be used. That’s RIDICULOUS.

    I was spanked as a child, often. And I don’t know if it was always completely necessary – and I know at times I was afraid to tell my mum if I made a mistake for fear of a spanking. But I don’t think I turned out all that bad for all that.

    Where I work, I sometimes wish I was in a management position, so I could bring the world down around the ears of certain staff members who have shit attitudes and are subtle bullies. It’s frustrating to see how bad things have to get before real consequences occur, and then what happens is the perpetrators act like f’in martyrs because they legit can’t understand how what they did was worthy of the harsh action – because they’d never suffered consequences before. We’re losing good staff members because of poor attitudes that are just allowed.. because you need to do something radically awful to actually get sacked. it’s ridiculous.

    I definitely like your bit about the boy with attitude issues. Consistency in consequences goes a long way as well… if you come down hard on person A for one behaviour, you have to come down hard on person B, C, D, E, F and even Z if they display the same behaviour. If there’s a discrepency in how the same kind of behaviour is responded to, then the one’s who experience harsher punishment just build resentment and believe it’s themselves who are being targeted, and not the behaviour…
    (also something that’s happening at the workplace… someone is close to being FIRED for being late, and no one else even gets spoken to for being late…)

    anyhow, it’s late, i should stop rambling… ;D
    maggie recently posted..Giant Kidney WormMy Profile

  4. Dayngr says:

    I could go on and on for hours about school and school discipline (or lack thereof), bullies and more but I won’t bore you. As for the abortion debate well, I’ll just say this – my opinion is that quality of life is as important as life itself.

    Excellent post. I’ve missed stopping by.
    Dayngr recently posted..Its Vintage Hand CarriedMy Profile

  5. Linda says:

    Good post, Kate. Valid points for impossible situations.

    If I would have had an abortion when I was young, it would have been better for the child because I was too selfish to be a parent. However, if I would have done that, I would regret it so much at this time of my life. It would just kill me.

    I wonder if people who don’t discipline, strict or otherwise, are just too lazy to make the effort. The concept of consequences is nothing new, and I would have expected the schools to be leading the charge. Even though you are strict as a teacher, I always like how you call them “MY kids”. I know your heart is in the right place because you sound like a mother hen caring for her chicks! Hahaha…

    I think the bottom line is, even though you don’t like their actions, you do like them… just like the boy who ended up holding your hand. What a crappy home life he must have had. It would be nice if we could all apply your principle to the grown-ups in our lives, too.

    Very inspiring… hugs : )

  6. I agree on the tough discipline. I remember being bullied in school, and nobody ever reprimanded the perpetrators. When I was briefly working in Hallmark over Christmas holidays, the amount of leniency parents had with their children was ABSURD! Sometimes they’d be knocking on our glass cases, demanding expensive figurines and screaming for attention…and no one stopped them. I’d rather see a parent cause a scene in a store than let their kids get away with that behaviour.

    I’m not a mom so I don’t know much, obviously. And I’ll never physically discipline my kids, obviously. But goddammit, if little Candice Jr. pushes around another girl in her classroom, I’m gonna lay the smack down with a verbal tongue lashing. And withhold all social media as a punishment.

  7. Pingback: Wherein I make everyone hate me, part 2. | Recommended Daily Dose

  8. nelson RN says:

    I also think that some some sort of discipline is applied to children who misbehave. Of course, that does not mean putting them in the dog cage like the one you mentioned in one case. just enough to make them REALIZE that what they did was WRONG and should NEVER be repeated. If my boy was hit by another child in school, I would always believe that the teacher will do something so that it does not happen again. Otherwise, I’LL BE THE ONE to do something.

    With regards to abortion, I’m really not in favor eversince. I still think that it’s KILLING SOMEBODY. Whether it’s done for the purpose of getting a good life for the mother and reducing crimes in the future, it’s still a crime (with the exception of therapeutic abortion where the life of the mother and the baby itself will be in danger when the pregnancy continues).
    Very reflective post, Kate!
    I’m checking out part 2 in a while…
    nelson RN recently posted..Why I became a nurseMy Profile

  9. Vince says:

    I firmly beleive that actions have consequences and the problem with many kids these days is that they don’t have to bear the consequences of thier actions. My parents were always bailing my brother out of trouble and he never really learned from it. I set high standards for my boys and give out punishment when I need to. I will say that other than taking away some privileges (my older son has lost his iPod until he gets his grades under control) I have not had to come down hard on them. Because my wife and I set the standard when they were little. Now, hopefully, they think a little more before acting.
    Vince recently posted..RamblingsMy Profile

  10. Kate says:

    Raven-
    That’s why I think it’s so important to have these conversations. Obviously if you’re daughters are wonderful girls (I would expect nothing less since they are YOUR daughters), that’s proof positive that you don’t need to rain down the pain for all kids. I personally don’t believe even for a second that you caused your daughters behavior and emotional problems…but it does raise a very interesting question…nature v. nurture. I believe that 2 people can be in the exact same environment and have completely different experiences for a variety of reasons. Even if they are genetically similar. The way their brains are formed and and all the good stuff can react totally differently. For example, my sister and I lived through the same experiences in our childhoods (only 2 years apart). However, she became like an adult. So I rebelled in high school and she was PERFECT in every way. I think because she knew mom was dealing with so much, she couldn’t even imagine adding more to her plate. She definitely had her wild times in college and now is nearly unrecognizable from the person she was growing up. I’m so glad to say that’s because she finally decided the only person she had to please is herself and she is the most amazing human being that I know. Funny thing is…which one was better? My sister carries far more scars from our childhood. I swore and drove my mom crazy, I let it all out. I have scars too…but they are so different than my sisters and I think maybe they go deeper. I don’t know…you really got me thinking though…thanks!

    Your second point. OH MY EVER LOVING GOD WOMAN!!!
    I am very strongly Pro-Choice. And what makes me crazy is that most of the time the same people that are anti-choice are also anti-public assistance of any kind. So, they want to force a woman to have a baby she can’t afford then refuse to help her support it. If the concern here was really for the ‘child’ wouldn’t they want to ensure that that child had enough food, clothing, a roof over their head etc.? The fact is, they don’t care about the child, they just want to control women’s bodies.
    I don’t think I’m capable of telling you how perfectly you captured this…and I had never thought about it in this way…so all I have to say is AMEN SISTER…AMEN!
    :) Kate

  11. Kate says:

    Denise-
    You are so lovely. Inside and out. I love the quote…that perfectly captures each and every important thing that we as fellow human beings owe our brother’s and sister’s. I hope you are well, I think of you often!
    :) Kate

  12. Kate says:

    Maggie-

    Please promise me that you will never stop rambling. It would make oh so very sad! I couldn’t agree with you more…it seems too dramatic one or the other. There has to be a middle ground. Dear God, I hope there is a middle ground! It makes me crazy when I’m watching TV and even if the perpetrator has admitted it they still have to say ALLEGEDLY. That goes with the innocent until proven guilty. I certainly don’t have all the answers for these really tough questions…but there has got to be a better way that how we are doing. I was watching a show about ending the silence about men (boys really) being molested. One had been molested by his father and even though his father admitted it, the host had to keep saying ALLEGEDLY. He was sharing this super difficult story with the world and I would imagine that would feel like people didn’t think he was telling the truth.

    On the other hand, I always believe the best in people (or try to anyways) and it makes me crazy when people are convicted and then DNA proves they didn’t do it. People have rotted in jail or even been killed who were wrongly convicted. Something must be changed…by someone who is much smarter than I!

    After my dad was out of the picture, my mom preferred to verbally spank us. Her looking into my eyes and telling me that I was a disappointment to her cut far deeper than a whack on the butt and the scar lasts a lot longer. I AM NOT trying to downplay the physical and emotional scars from being spanked because it’s very serious and can sometimes be closer to beating than spanking. But a tongue can cut deep too.

    I get REALLY angry when I hear about where you work. Not only because I think you are absolutely fabulous and have a bigger heart than the country you live in, but because you are an excellent vet. I would trust any of my animals to you, and they are my babies. This is like what happened at school and it drives me nuts. Not only does it make the workplace a horrendous place you want to avoid at all costs, but also it puts the focus on this unimportant stuff instead of caring for the animals and I’m sure it drives you up the wall!! My kids would complain, saying it wasn’t fair and I always said “fair isn’t everyone getting the same thing, it’s everyone getting what they need.” I don’t think everything has to be “the same” but I do have a HUGE problem with different rules for different people and different consequences, which it sounds like what you are dealing with and once again, it takes away from the mission that you are attempting to accomplish while you are at work. Good thing I don’t live close, I would come and kick some butt. Maybe that’s why I got fired from my job…I hate drama…
    :) Kate

  13. Kate says:

    Dayngr-

    Where have you been?? It’s so funny, I was thinking about you just the other day and was headed over to see you. So glad to see you again…I miss you when you go away!!

    I love your quote–
    my opinion is that quality of life is as important as life itself.
    That’s what life is all about, for me at least!
    :) Kate

  14. Kate says:

    Linda,

    I wonder if you had gotten pregnant and chosen to keep the baby and it had really wrecked your chances of making something of yourself which created a path that your child couldn’t get off and it led them into disaster. I am not saying that you wouldn’t regret your decision if you had an abortion, I’m simply asking if it’s possible you might have also regretted keeping the child and then not being able to provide for it. Obviously it is a complicated and very personal issue and none of us have a crystal ball to tell us the future (unless you keep one in your closet…if so, please let me know what lotto numbers are going to win…mkay)???

    I think it’s a bad situation and each choice needs to be considered carefully on an individual basis. If a girl gets pregnant and she has financial and other support (like her parents being able to watch the kid so she can finish school and such as this) it is a very different situation than a girl who was kicked out for being pregnant, no money, no shelter, no food, etc. There are no easy answers, that’s for sure!

    I think that people today have a hard time standing their ground (even with their kids) because they’re so afraid of being a parent, they want to be the kid’s friend. So whatever they want, the kids end up wearing the parent down. Kids pretend this is what they want, but it’s not. You won’t find any more miserable kids than the one’s that get everything they ask for, the one’s who runs their homes and families. Because you can give a child every material gifts ever made, but you’re not giving the child what’s really important. They will learn that the way to happiness is through retail therapy, but it is no different than a drug high or any other addiction. The first high is AMAZING and from then on, they are forever chasing that feeling, and they will destroy themselves getting there because true happiness cannot be bought and they will never feel that first high again.

    Finn was in the grocery store with me the other day and he was throwing a holy fit. Screaming, kicking, crying, flailing arms…you name it, he was doing it. I saw people looking, of course I felt very embarrassed. I don’t even remember what he wanted. Probably to get out of the cart and walk, but he disappears, so I make him sit in the cart (and also he’s at the age where he understands the basics of shopping and see’s things he wants, so he grabs them and throws them in the cart while my back is turned). I took him out of the cart, to the back corner next to the toilet paper and he served his time right there, hollering and carrying on like I was torturing him. I was mortified, I wanted to climb behind the toilet paper and disappear. Finally his time out was over and I have not had to give him another one in the middle of shopping. Am I banking on never having to do it again, no, I might have to do it again, I would be surprised if I didn’t. But he knows that I don’t care where we are, I expect him to behave and if he makes the choice not to, he will receive his consequences just as if we are home. I think parents are truly terrified of doing this, living through it, I know it’s no fun. Josh didn’t want me to do it. But if I had given him his way, he would remember that and know that if he threw a fit in public, he would get what he wanted. I refuse to be held hostage by my son. Not because I don’t love him, but because I do. And I know all parents love kids, but sometimes I really wonder if they know how to show their kids that love, and the first step is being the wicked mother of the west if they need a reminder about who’s in charge!!

    :) Kate

  15. Kate says:

    Candice-

    Can I call you Candy? If my name was Candice and someone asked to call me Candy I would hit them hard, where it counts. Too bad I’m obnoxious like that.

    Seeing people “parent” in public makes me want to tear my hair out, but I guess it’s because they aren’t really parenting at all. I think that you can tell more about who a person is by watching them interact with servers, cashiers, etc. than in almost any other setting. It makes me cringe to think what you saw and heard, they not only treated you like crap but they allowed their children too. Whenever I’m out in public I literally have to stop myself when I see wild kids, because I don’t play.

    They obviously didn’t realize you are an amazing writer and just a fabulous person in general, or they would have treated you like the Queen of England…and that’ just the point…it freaks me out to think how close I am to being that bum on the corner holding sign asking for change. God’s grace and our parents are the only things standing between that being my reality.

    Ok…mommy confession. I spanked my son once. I always swore I would never lay a hand on him, for no reason, ever. He locked me out of the house. Not on purpose, but it scared the living hell out of me. He was inside the house trying to get the door open for 5 minutes and I was hyperventilating. When I finally got to him he got one swift smack on the bottom and he was straight into time out. He was SO upset more because he understood the severity of it more than it really pained him. I found my exception, when it’s a life threatening situation, I will introduce my hand to his back side so he understands the severity of the situation. I don’t know if I’m right or wrong, probably both…I’m sure you’re going to be an awesome mother.

    You could name your daughter Cane…so together you could be Candy Cane. Please pretend I didn’t write that. Please don’t unfriend me!
    😉 Kate

  16. Kate says:

    Nelson-

    Great points also. I, of course, value life at starting from conception…that is a life. I wish no one would ever have an abortion. But I also wish that no child in the world would ever go to bed hungry, or get horrendous diseases because they don’t have mere dollars to buy mosquito netting or pay for medication or even vaccinations, I wish that all child will have excellent education and health care, and I wish that each child has a mother and father (or a mother and a mother, father and a father) who not only love that child more than anything, but also love one another. But that is a perfect world and only exists in our dreams.

    Of course, I value life, any and all life…so this is a very difficult issue for me. I don’t know if it’s more about the freedom of choice or the fact that I see where these kids can end up, and no one should have to live through that. I think we can take it too far…people don’t believe in birth control…how about all the unused eggs in women? They are “killing” potential babies each time they have their period. And if we went the other way, men would get a vasectomy until they could prove they were equipped to be father’s. I get very scared when we start handing over the rights to our bodies.

    I am afraid if the situations were reversed and the argument was over men’s bodies, it wouldn’t stand for a moment. Because of the traditional role of women (and some countries still believe this), I believe that men and women believe they have the right to control our bodies. Another huge problem that I have is that people who are pro-life are often for the death penalty. If every life is valuable, then why do humans have the right to end a life? For me, it has to be one way or the other and if women are forced to carry babies to term, then the only way to do that is making sure each and every child is provided for…and in the present time…we are far from there.

    But that’s my opinion…I appreciate yours…we may have to agree to disagree. However, I LOVE intelligent conversations, I think they’re so important!!

    :) Kate

  17. Kate says:

    Vince-

    The proof is in the pudding…for sure!! I think it’s crucial to set expectations early because it’s so much easier to do it then than when they’re bigger and stronger (and think they have all the answers)…Finn (for the moment) doesn’t think I’m an idiot…so I’m going to capitalize on that. He’ll pass my intellectual abilities in about 3.4 weeks. I say good on you for taking away the ipod…I’m sure your son thought it was torture…but to me, it’s a privilege and a privilege is earned, not handed out.

    And I have to say that you and your wife deserve some extra praise because there is little more difficult than raising a child with Autism…doing that successfully…well not many parents can. I’m not sure I could. I tip my hat to you…he’s so lucky to have you!!

    :) Kate

  18. Pingback: They will know we are Christians… | Recommended Daily Dose

  19. Pingback: Wherein I make everyone hate me (again). | Recommended Daily Dose

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

CommentLuv badge